10.6 Tutorial: POST2 - Record Cue

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gooze
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Re: 10.6 Tutorial: POST2 - Record Cue

Post by gooze » Thu Jul 16, 2009 6:10 am

jgoss wrote:Fantastic job Bobby. The tutorial's are really great. If only the manual was written in the same easy to understand fashion...
:!: :!: :!:

My notes:
Maybe start the tutorial with the fact that the console needs to be in a certain personality and state that people should experiment with the settings to find you own favorites. Settings are well explained in the tutorial.

Maybe mention first that [SHIFT] and all the actions you will discuss bring up a window that contains extra help with that function.

p. 7-8 If you dedicate a considerable amount of space to tracking, you should do the same for This Cue Only. e.g.:
This Cue Only comes from the preset boards, that replaced the manually operated resistance dimmers backstage. On these boards you could set up multiple cues (or looks) in advance. (Pre-set) Because of it's nature you'd have to set the entire look for every single bank of faders. You could then fade between those banks of faders.
The advantage of this is that if something changes in one cue (or look) it will never affect others. And, while it can seem quicker to only program the lights that change, don't forget that with Cue Only lights that go to zero don't have to be recorded. So if you have lighting states that change a lot it can actualy be quicker to work in Cue Only mode. It is also less difficult to record cues in a different order than they will be played. If you'd have to record a show where cue 3, 7, 9, 11, 15 and 21 are the same and everything else is different, you don't have to worry about tracking channels in Cue Only.
p. 10 Maybe you could explain the word "assert" a bit more.

p. 11 "Show checkpoint time" The menu item itself is unclear. You could easily think that the checkpoint time is shown somewhere. "Autosave checkpoint file (in minutes)" would be much clearer (Although this is not a point for your tutorial)

p. 12 I would not give your readers the idea that the console is so unstable that you'd better save after every keypress. (They will find out themselves after a while :twisted: )

p. 20 "Deleting a range of cues is no different that deleting a single cue. It just applies to multiple
cues. "
This paragraph also has the first mention of the infamous Blue Box. Maybe you should mention earlier or tell a bit more what it is here. I would prefer to talk about 'selected cel', rather than blue box. I know it is another part of Horizon history that I am talking about. It might be sensitive, but it must make sense (and sensibility!)

p. 22 Remove Redundant Data is already mentioned on page 18. Why split the information. I think the parts on p. 18 and 22 should swap or be joined to one.

p. 26 Warn for the fact that people should try to navigate in blind with the Step forward/Step back keys for the cuelist. They always control your live cuelist! (Made that mistake!)

p. 27 Moving Around the Cue List. You'd like to have this information much earlier.

p. 29 "The logic is that it is always DELAY / FADE since that’s the way time works in the universe." What universe? Explain. This doesn't make it easier for me to understand.

p. 30 I would explain the independent timing first and then go to cue parts. Because the concept of independent timing makes partcues obsolete. The only use for them is to graphically show what happens when and to be able to label what is going on when.

p. 31 Maybe mention the labeling of normal cues earlier.

p. 39 Follow (time) will start counting from the moment the cue that is to be followed on starts. So in your example there is 4 seconds between the completion of the cue, till the next cue is following.

p. 41 It would make sense to explain deleting cues here. If you delete cues that were skipped with a link before you'd have to delete preserving the cuestate. (I forgot the precise terminology here)

p. 48 see posts above! Please change for sake of clarity.

p. 53 and before. In these cases it could be useful to mention the default values or the values you used for the examples in the tutorial.

p. 55 Maybe you could explain 'external SMPTE' it refers to a physical connector on the console?

I miss releasing the cue, cuelist or all cuelists in an early part of the tutorial (only the mouse action is explained on p. 58)

Pfff. That was a long one!
Floriaan Ganzevoort - Lighting designer
THEATERMACHINE design. production. operations.

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Re: 10.6 Tutorial: POST2 - Record Cue

Post by TaineGilliam » Thu Jul 16, 2009 10:04 am

#1:

I'm not sure I agree with all of the suggested text above on Q-Only. I find it a source of great confusion that people often think "Q-Only" is the same as "Preset" or "Tracking Off".

Q-Only does NOTHING as far as the recording of the specified cue - it handles the cleanup in the next cue, if one exist. For the last Cue in the Cue List, Tracking/Q-Only are no different.

Preset or Tracking Off would alter the way the specified cue is recorded.

#2:

I do however think Delete Q-Only needs a paragraph or two.

Should the UI be more consistent and choose between Retain Cue Data(dialog box) and Q-Only(command line)?

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Re: 10.6 Tutorial: POST2 - Record Cue

Post by gooze » Thu Jul 16, 2009 10:24 am

TaineGilliam wrote:Q-Only does NOTHING as far as the recording of the specified cue - it handles the cleanup in the next cue, if one exist. For the last Cue in the Cue List, Tracking/Q-Only are no different.
Q-Only records hard values in every cue. I am talking about the Q-only mode you set in the Show set-up.
If you are talking about storing a cue as Cue Only in an otherwise tracking cuelist, you are completely right.
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Re: 10.6 Tutorial: POST2 - Record Cue

Post by TaineGilliam » Thu Jul 16, 2009 10:44 am

GAH !!! I think that is not actually the case but I'd love to have Robert/Alan/Bobby confirm.

If it is true, can we PLEASE rename that option to "Tracking OFF" or better yet make it a three state choice like the old days - Tracking, Q-Only, Tracking Off?

I do remember a discussion about a mode that would do Block Cues with Redundant data display cleanup but I didn't know we had it.

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Re: 10.6 Tutorial: POST2 - Record Cue

Post by gooze » Thu Jul 16, 2009 10:57 am

Sorry Taine. I think you are right concerning the 'behind the scenes' bit. I am more talking in a simplified way, suitable for a tutorial. In that sense it matters what is the clearest way to put things.
Floriaan Ganzevoort - Lighting designer
THEATERMACHINE design. production. operations.

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Re: 10.6 Tutorial: POST2 - Record Cue

Post by BobbyHarrell » Sat Jul 18, 2009 5:52 am

I'll deal with the two of you later.

I decided that the second tutorial should expand to cover basic recording of cues, subs and groups.
Attachments
POST2-Basic Recording.pdf
(3.92 MiB) Downloaded 148 times
Bobby Harrell - Product Specialist
Philips Entertainment - Strand Lighting

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Re: 10.6 Tutorial: POST2 - Record Cue

Post by gooze » Sat Jul 18, 2009 10:15 am

p. 5 Your remark on softkeys should maybe also mention how to get to the Green Softkeys on different consoles (and maybe on the external keyboard or OLE)
Floriaan Ganzevoort - Lighting designer
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Re: 10.6 Tutorial: POST2 - Record Cue

Post by RobertBell » Sat Jul 18, 2009 12:04 pm

Gooze wrote:Q-Only records hard values in every cue.
TaineGilliam wrote:GAH !!! I think that is not actually the case but I'd love to have Robert/Alan/Bobby confirm.
I think you guys are now on the same page - but for the record, the only way to record hard values of the entire rig in every cue is to record every cue a block cue. Taine is right that Q-Only really is record this cue and undo the changes in the next cue after the cue I'm recording (updating) if and only if there is no data already there for these channels.
If you are appending to the end of a cue list - it matter not if you record/update Q-Only or Tracking.

To add gasoline to the fire - there is now a preset option in the cue list properties (also similar in functionality to the chase up/down cue lists types minus the auto-follow behaviour) which IF YOU USE REC LIVE, does record all levels (including hard zeros) for all channels in all cues. THIS DOES SIMULATE A PRESET DESK. This is why I suggest using record DELTA when building these (very handy) cue lists.
Robert Bell - Product Manager - Horizon Control Inc.

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Re: 10.6 Tutorial: POST2 - Record Cue

Post by dla001 » Sat Jul 18, 2009 11:14 pm

How about putting a rev. number in the filename of your tutorials, so we can see if our copy is current? These are great! I'm recommending them to all the new users of these consoles.

Thanks for the good work!

David

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Re: 10.6 Tutorial: POST2 - Record Cue

Post by JohnGrimshaw » Sun Jul 19, 2009 2:14 am

Finally getting a chance to go through this tutorial (well done Bobby). Some notes I have...

pg13 "I like to leave this option checked. That way, if I have a channel deltaed, it will stay with me rather than reverting to the cue."
- You might want to add: "It may be helpful to have this UNCHECKED when running your show, so that you can make a live change, and then allow the cue to re-take control as required."

pg26 "Navigating The Cue List While In Blind
The easiest way to navigate the cue list while you are in blind is to use the inverted T arrow
keys. The up arrow will take you to the previous cue number and the down arrow will take you
to the next cue number."

- You might want to add: "Be careful - just because you are in blind, it does not mean to cannot change the lights on the stage. Your GO button still works live, and so will Double Clicking on a cue number in blind. If you use the arrows to move the blue box around, then that is the easiest solution."
- of course, it would be my preference that double clicking DID NOT change the live cue, but that is a software thing.

Good work! I'll be using this extensively for teaching people the consoles.
...and for more entertainment industry trivia and useless facts, just ask:
John Grimshaw
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Stage Fast Pty Ltd

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