Palette VL - A list of things

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MickCrozier
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Palette VL - A list of things

Post by MickCrozier » Wed Apr 01, 2009 11:56 pm

Hi guys

I've been playing with the Offline Editor for a few days now.
And Yesterday got a loaner Palette VL 16 from Bytecraft

I'll start by saying i'm impressed. It's intuitive, the basics are basic (YAY!)
Patching is straight forward, The screen layout is great.
Select options and predictive text are fantastic!
Remote connection was a breeze to set up.
I'm especially impressed by the depth of the macro system.
And OpenPalette IMO is the best thing cheese on toast.

But as with all things I found some issues (wants and ideas aswell :D )

I've only been playing a few days - So I welcome comments from the peanut gallery.
I may be doing something wrong or have missed an option somewhere.
And some of this might have been covered before.
-----

Most of these tests I ran on the Offline Editor last night (10.5.21)
But the console I have is running 10.5.19


Cue Vs Look Vs FX, HTP, LTP - Doesn't work the way I expect

Some scenrios I ran:

Basically 2 channels in the cue 1 @ 40, 2 @ 0
Look/sub is channels 1+2 @ full

Sub as HTP
Cue and sub same priority
= Sub works with cue, showing live as whicherver is higher. (Great!)
Cue higher
= Sub can't been seen, cue holds both channels (Great!)
Cue Lower
= Subs takes completely takes over both channels (Great!)

With sub as LTP
Cue and sub same priority
= Sub does not take over channels when activated after cue, instead inreasing channel 1 at a slightly slower rate than the off channel - to meet at 100%
(huh? Shouldn't the sub take over both channels in live)
Cue higher
= Sub can't been seen, cue holds both channels (Great!)
Cue Lower
= Same as same priority


Next I attached a basic square wave wrap effect to a look - just 1 thru 10.
In the cue I ran up every second channel to 40.

Sub as HTP
Cue and sub same priority
= Effect only appears on unreferenced channels by the cue (no good at all, needs to be HTPas with a static channel) <- This is the BIG one
Cue Higher
= Effect not visible (Great!)
Cue Lower
= Effect takes over (Great!)

Sub as LTP
Cue and sub same priority
= Effect takes over required channels (Great!)
Cue Higher
= Effect not seen (Great!)
Cue Lower
= Effect takes over required channels (Great!)

It seems effects running on looks are either treated as never show on active channels OR
Completely take over - rurning active channels to zero when not used in the effect. (this is no good at all)
FX should work the same as if they were a static channel.

There needs to be a clear difference between LTP and HTP that is consistant (when priority is the same)
LTP takes over, HTP shows whatever is higher.

the only issue I found when doing cue vs cue from differnt cue lists was when I attached an effect to the second cue, same results as if the effect is attached to look.

FX saved in cues have no way to specify it's priority vs the cue, even a htp option will be good. Instead it always overtakes the channels
I often want to run a chase with many lights including FOH washes etc, It's often required that a few of these lights never go completly off to keep dancers on stage seen.
I could beat this with a look chase, but that means creating a series of looks to suit the cue every time I need it.
Way quicker just to leave 1 or 2 of the 15 channels at 50% in the cue and create a square wave chase with all 15 over the top.

.

Other Suggestions
Spacebar and Go have differnt functions - Go will go on the main cue list, spacebar will go on the current cue list -
perhaps:
Alt - Go = Go on current selected cue list
Alt - Shift - Go = Assert current cue in current cue list
And make the space bar work the same way

--

Adjustable colour scheme on dialog boxes - they are sometimes hard to read.

--

This is probably the most complex sugestion (want :D ).
Ability to:
Run up a lighting state, add an effect via subs. Effect gets dumped into cue when recorded (if elect to record subs).
But not the output of the effect!

This comes from plotting dance shows in a hurry over the rehearsal.
Once the base state has been created and the effect is running and the director is happy -

Currently on our Strand 300, it goes.

Stop effect
Record cue
Add effect start option to cue (for more than 1 effect we need to create a macro)
create blank next cue and add effect stop marker
Restart effect.
Sequence takes around 15 seconds (as long as no macro is required)
the director is spitting the dummy because the lights have stopped flashing.

If the VL could work as I described, we're talking a few seconds to record a cue with effects.


If all the FX, htp, ltp stuff I've talked about was implemented. IMO - Strand could easily once again capture the hearts of operators here in Melbourne,
where just about every operator I know has run an end of year dance/silly season.
It would save prescious minutes, in cases of larger shows - maybe even hours!
Formerly Durisian (who died peacefully of digital old age)

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JohnGrimshaw
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Re: Palette VL - A list of things

Post by JohnGrimshaw » Thu Apr 02, 2009 4:59 am

Ok - just a quick note for everyone - yes this console is running a BETA version of the "soon to be released" software, so much of what is described here is not yet available in v 10.4.12. That said, lets answer at least one question...
Durisian wrote:This is probably the most complex sugestion (want :D ).
Ability to:
Run up a lighting state, add an effect via subs. Effect gets dumped into cue when recorded (if elect to record subs).
But not the output of the effect!
My recommended solution to this is actually to record the effect into the submaster (you have 99,999 per page, so it does not have to be one of your REAL ones), and then use a macro in the cue list to "bump on" and "bump off" the effect. That way you can build up a bunch of effects for your dance school season, and pick'n'choose from them as required.
Durisian wrote:Cue Vs Look Vs FX, HTP, LTP - Doesn't work the way I expect
and the rest of your description...

Following our discussion on this, I have posted in the BETA section of this website something that (hopefully) highlights your problem. for those with BETA access, it is here:
viewtopic.php?f=15&t=1882

For everyone else, is a summary of the exchanges happening on that post:
- make all effects able to operate as HTP

As I mentioned in the BETA post, I was able to achieve what was needed by creating a new Cue List, and doing a chase using follws and loops. But I have another idea...
...and for more entertainment industry trivia and useless facts, just ask:
John Grimshaw
Managing Director
Stage Fast Pty Ltd

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MickCrozier
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Location: Melbourne, Australia

Re: Palette VL - A list of things

Post by MickCrozier » Thu Apr 02, 2009 5:13 am

Oh right, cool, the beta section... getting a bit ahead of myself I guess :geek:
JohnGrimshaw wrote:
My recommended solution to this is actually to record the effect into the submaster (you have 99,999 per page, so it does not have to be one of your REAL ones), and then use a macro in the cue list to "bump on" and "bump off" the effect. That way you can build up a bunch of effects for your dance school season, and pick'n'choose from them as required.
Oh yeah, it can be done - Just like we're used to on our 300 series (sort of anyway). But that's more button presses (we're very lazy at the National :D ) - Just an idea!

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Re: Palette VL - A list of things

Post by JohnGrimshaw » Thu Apr 02, 2009 5:26 am

Here is the HTP effect working. (attached)

What I did:
1) created some cue in a list that I could run the chase under
2) created a "Bump Chase" (this is a Beta function for hte new software, where "looks" from a specific page are "chased")
3) put a macro on Cue 1 the "bumps" the chase "on"

Because all of the subs are HTP, the effect "overlays" the cues.

Limitation: The older "built in" effects will not work like this - only "Bump" chases will.
Attachments
HTP-ChaseEffect.spf
This is a 10.5.20 file, that will not open on the release version of the Palette software.
(35 KiB) Downloaded 66 times
...and for more entertainment industry trivia and useless facts, just ask:
John Grimshaw
Managing Director
Stage Fast Pty Ltd

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