Stopping an Effect

Questions on Palette and Light Palette operation and features
kkennel
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Stopping an Effect

Post by kkennel » Thu Oct 02, 2008 3:23 pm

Sorry, I am sure this is an easy one, but thanks to all the wonderful previous information, I finally was able to record my effect. Now, how do I stop it?
I would like it to go out with a cue. I'm working with a Light Palette Classic.
Thanks so much,
Krystal

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RobertBell
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Re: Stopping an Effect

Post by RobertBell » Thu Oct 02, 2008 3:31 pm

I just have to laugh because when it rains - it pours. People are really confused about this and clearly we have to do a better job.

Basically - very much unlike the 500 - you don't have to stop the FX. You just need to fade the lights to a new level. The 500 (like it or not) really ran FXs as multiple cuelists do in Palette. FXs ran off in another parallel world. In Palette, it would be like creating a new cue list with the fx steps, then macroing from the main cue list to start the other cue list going, then later macroing to release that cue list.

Our current FXs are MUCH more powerful than that as they track just like static values. Let me quote a bit I wrote over on the beta side of this forum just an hour ago:
AmberTomlin wrote:Could we have a quick short cut button for stopping pre programmed effects? i.e. Ive create my pre programmed effect and update it into a cue.
Clearly Alan and I are in a complete minority to think that fading a light to a new value is 'nice and tidy' way to stop it from doing what it is doing now. What you (and everybody else) is asking for is akin this example:
  1. Light is on chair
  2. Light moves to girl
  3. light tracks on girl
  4. light tracks on girl
  5. I don't want light on girl any more
  6. why is light on girl?
  7. why is light still on girl? (geeze I wish I could put it back on the chair - but I don't know how to do that)
  8. Ah - put light on chair
What you (and everybody else wants) is a Please don't be on girl anymore switch you can add to a cue which will take it back to its last level (in this case, chair).

We'll give it to you becuase I'm tired of explaining the power and use of the current way it is implimented :evil:
So - the short answer is - fade the lights in the FX to a new value. It will stop itself.
Robert Bell - Product Manager - Horizon Control Inc.

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RobertBell
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Re: Stopping an Effect

Post by RobertBell » Thu Oct 02, 2008 3:37 pm

Alan just pointed out that one of the parameters of the FX is DURATION. You may want to change this to ACTIVE CUE (vs. CONTINUOUS)
Robert Bell - Product Manager - Horizon Control Inc.

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gooze
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Re: Stopping an Effect

Post by gooze » Thu Oct 02, 2008 3:53 pm

The point is that you almost always want an effect to start and end in the same lighting state. This means that you don't want to change any level. WE JUST WANT TO STOP EFFECTS. And the load function is ridiculous and nobody can explain in less than a sentence what it does. Is it just for stopping effects? Stop the effect and update the cue that is what we want. Just four keystrokes.
[S10 Effect][S?? - Stop effect][Update][Enter]
Simple.
Or if it's your next cue you are programming:
[Record][Enter]
Why on earth is this not possible?

And please make an effort to explain load once and for all, then Bill Richards could write it in the manual on page one.
Floriaan Ganzevoort - Lighting designer
THEATERMACHINE design. production. operations.

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amoyer
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Re: Stopping an Effect

Post by amoyer » Thu Oct 02, 2008 5:38 pm

Did you miss what Robert said a couple of posts above? They are going to put a "STOP EFFECT" button into the software.
Andrew Moyer - Oakville Centre for the Performing Arts
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BrianEvans
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Re: Stopping an Effect

Post by BrianEvans » Thu Oct 02, 2008 8:16 pm

Load:
Bring everything from a cue or look into the programmer with deltas as if still working on it.

One sentance.

;)

If you know how to run a Hog or a GrandMA you'll use it often,
if not, you probably wont.
Brian Evans - System Specialist - Horizon Control Inc.

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JohnGrimshaw
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Re: Stopping an Effect

Post by JohnGrimshaw » Fri Oct 03, 2008 7:04 am

Yes, you can just "take control" of the lights to kill an effect, but something I noticed today might be a little problem...

Q1: Blackout
Q2: Intensity Effect running on 10 channels
Q3: Those ten channels are recorded at ZERO to kill the effect

Great - that works just fine. Interestingly, those 10 channels are WHITE, indicating that are effectively redundant data as far as the console is concerned. So guess what happens when you run "Remove Redundant Data All Cues". Yep - the cue now tracks forward into uncharted territory!

Now, an "Effect Stop" command is what 300/500 users are used to - there is no avoiding that. It is ingrained into our souls, and we will continue to ask for it. However, we just need to be sure we can "selectively" kill a specific effect if there are multiple running at the same time. For example, using one cue list to start an effect and another to release it (or pause it, or restart it)

My suggestion is that a "name" field is created for an effect, so it can be identified, and that a command needs to have the same name to work - and maybe multiple names separated by a comma - and maybe use "*" to control all running effects.
...and for more entertainment industry trivia and useless facts, just ask:
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RobertBell
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Re: Stopping an Effect

Post by RobertBell » Fri Oct 03, 2008 11:31 am

JohnGrimshaw wrote:Great - that works just fine. Interestingly, those 10 channels are WHITE, indicating that are effectively redundant data as far as the console is concerned. So guess what happens when you run "Remove Redundant Data All Cues". Yep - the cue now tracks forward into uncharted territory!
This is a known issue. Also - a REC LIVE would trip you up because it does a remove redundant data after the record, so if you grab the lights (which are at zero in cue 1) change them to zero to stop the fx, then Rec Live - they are not recorded in the cue and hence the FX will continue. That is why I'm partial to REC DELTA so there is no magic going on behind my back. Clearly though, you have to understand what is going on to paint the full picture and REC LIVE suites most people using one cue list just fine.

Until we get the STOP FX thing sorted (as mentioned above and pointed out again by amoyer (thank you)), I suggest the people that don't like our S10-Effects package write effects exactly as they did in 500 land. That is:

Use another cue list and macro into and out of it.

You many not of thought that is what you were doing with the 500, but you were. :o

A word of advice though - if you build an effect on another cue list that only affects a small sub-set of lights, when you build it - use REC DELTA. You don't want to record the whole rig (REC LIVE) into each step of your effect. Or - go BLIND. Again - this was how the 500 worked for you (in the background).
Robert Bell - Product Manager - Horizon Control Inc.

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Re: Stopping an Effect

Post by MattKlasmeier » Fri Oct 03, 2008 3:57 pm

JohnGrimshaw wrote: My suggestion is that a "name" field is created for an effect, so it can be identified, and that a command needs to have the same name to work - and maybe multiple names separated by a comma - and maybe use "*" to control all running effects.
John,

I like that idea. It works with the cue list synchronization concept. I would love it even more if all I had to do is then insert the name into another cue and the effect could be triggered again. The one thing I would like to see all of the effects stored in a "bank" or group so it would make it easy to see the name and allow them to be worked on in blind.

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BrianEvans
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Re: Stopping an Effect

Post by BrianEvans » Fri Oct 03, 2008 6:05 pm

So Rob H., I am sure you are totally thrilled about GrandMA having more than one blind huh?
8-)
Brian Evans - System Specialist - Horizon Control Inc.

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